Dr hab. Hanna Dymel-Trzebiatowska, prof. UG, talks to Aleksandra Kuś about her book Philosophical and Translator's Wanderings in the Moominvalley, the non-binary Groke and the phenomenon of the Moomins.

- In your publications, I have noticed a concentration of interest not only in the world of the Moomins themselves but also in works for children and young people, for example, the works of Astrid Lindgren. When did you get the idea to channel these interests into research?

- My adventure with this literature has been going on for more than 20 years. I think the choice of the topic for my PhD can be considered the beginning. When I started working at UG as an assistant I had to choose 'my' research space and I concluded that I have always been interested in the works of Astrid Lindgren. Most people associate her mainly with Pippi, but I wanted to look at lesser-known works that had not yet been translated into Polish at the time. What fascinates me, and will probably continue to fascinate me in literature for the rest of my life, is its effect on the psyche. What is it that fiction offers us that has such an incredible effect on human beings? We like, we love and we rally to a character who is actually homo fictus, not homo sapiens. And so the theme of my thesis, dressed up in the Polish title, The Therapeutic Potential of Astrid Lindgren's Books, began to crystallise. To get to the narrative structures that I assume have an impact on the psyche, I analysed selected works using the methodology at my disposal as a literary scholar. In my doctoral thesis, I extracted some therapeutic patterns that can be used in bibliotherapy, when treating thanatophobia (fear of death) in children. To answer strictly the question you asked me. The research into books for children arose from a fascination with Lindgren already during my studies and an attempt to answer a question that has been stuck in my head - What makes fictional stories trigger changes in our psyche and lives?

- At what point did the idea to write books about the Moomins emerge?

- This is one of the next stages of my academic work. For many years I was focused on Lindgren and then my interests shifted to translatology, although further in the context of her books, until the moment came, after my habilitation, when I had to say goodbye to this writer. I also felt more freedom to write then. As I mentioned in the introduction of my 'Moomin' book, the idea to write it came after reading the work of Pippi and Socrates. In it, two Norwegian philosophers explore the parallels between the content of the Pippi Longstocking books and the construction of the character itself, and the thought concepts of philosophers such as Nietzsche, or indeed Socrates. It was then that I began to notice that, after all, this kind of relationship also appears in the Moomins.

- So can we risk saying that Jansson has created her own philosophy under the sign of the Moomins?

- Yes, there is a lot of talk about the philosophy of the Moomins. Philosophy can be understood in two ways: in scientific terms and more generally as a philosophy of life. In my book, I showed that the Moomins philosophy arose from the 'real' philosophy that Jansson herself knew. Being in a relationship with Atos Wirtanen, a Finnish philosopher, she was exposed to philosophical works such as Spengler's Twilight of the West, for example, which provided the foundation for the reflections contained in the Moomins.

- What do you think has made the Moomins a phenomenon?

- Certainly, the Moomin Characters company takes care of that, but if the content of the books were not still relevant, no amount of action would save the Moomins. In my opinion, their popularity continues to grow, precisely because of their timelessness. I have the impression that Jansson, who was a brilliant observer, was able to weave with great delicacy into the statements and general characterisation of the characters many surprisingly topical life truths. This is what I want to point out in my book, the vast amount of topical content relating, for example, to gender issues, ageism or ecology.

- Staying on the topic of the topicality of the moomin world, I recently came across an interpretation of the Groke as a non-binary person. I would like to know if this is an over-interpretation or if it fits this topicality and timelessness into our reality.

- Everyone has the right to see in fiction what is topical and important in her or his life. This is the specificity of contact with literature, which depends on the sensitivity and uniqueness of each reader. I didn't notice this aspect of Groke's character, perhaps because in the original she is unambiguously referred to by the pronoun 'hon', i.e. she. As far as her visualisation is concerned, however, her dress-like fur does not prejudge the issue, as male Hemulens also wear clothes, let's say dress-like clothes. To answer more specifically, when I look at the Valley overall it is saturated with transgressions and hybrids. There, at various levels, whether of characterisation or plot, we encounter many ambiguities. For example, the friendship between Moomin, representing a child, and Snufkin, possessing the characteristics of an adult. Or the characters of Thingumy and Bob. But coming back to the Groke, the hybridity of the whole moomin world was perhaps also written into her characterisation. And this was recognised by those readers who read her as a non-binary character. Jansson, through these numerous hybrids, reminds us that the world is complex and cannot be clearly systematised.

- I've noticed that when I throw the phrase 'Moomins' around, both my peers and those who are a little older have a good grasp of the subject, while this awareness is slowly beginning to fade in younger readers. Do you think the Moomins will still be read?

- I can't answer this question, as I would need to have specific data. In general, as far as I know, reading among children does not look rosy. Books are being displaced by other media that potential readers find more entertaining. Myself, I think there is a group of children who still read, and if there is a representation of children who read, there will be some who love the Moomins. Recently I was looking for a particular edition of a picture book of precisely Jansson's 'Book about Moomin, Mymble and Little My' and I found it in one of Oliva's libraries. It showed signs of use and then for the first time I was genuinely pleased to see a tattered book. You could see that many little paws had touched it and it felt very nice. If certain children read, there will be some to whom the Moomins will certainly appeal.

- In your opinion, would the Moomins be the Moomins if the nature of their characters were transformed?

- The nature of the characters in the Moomins books, as can be seen over the nine volumes, is dynamic. Yes, they have stereotypical traits - Moominmamma is good and Filifjonkan is nervous and so on - but they are not static, which is what I am trying to point out in my new book, currently being finished. The dynamics are evident when reading all the volumes in the correct, i.e. according to their writing and publication in Finland, order. For example - Moominmamma is different at the beginning of the series and different in the penultimate volume (Moominpappa at Sea). In general, we can see the evolution of the land of the Moomins most clearly in just this penultimate, eighth volume. For example, the Moomin ceases to be a child and grows into a young man who decides to move away from home. The Groke is no longer a monster and turns out to be a lonely Groke. And Moominmamma leaves the family for a while. The nature of the characters changes, while at the same time they keep certain traits constant, in keeping with their somewhat stereotypical nature.

- And characters such as Hemulen or Snufkin? They do not undergo a spectacular transformation. So it can be assumed that they represent values that are universal and should remain unchanged?

- Yes, I admit that the Hemulen is relatively constant, although let's remember that there are many Hemulens. I think we mistakenly treat them as one character precisely because of this constancy or repetition in their nature. The Hemulen upholds the rules, likes to order his life and the lives of others, and wants to share his knowledge of how best to live with people because for some reason he has decided that he has this knowledge. Hemulen undergoes a transformation in the volumes, but a minimal one, as does Snufkin with his love of freedom. Looking at the Valley as a whole, the characters who inhabit it embody a variety of human characters, although, for the most part, we are not dealing strictly with humans, more with again hybrid human-animal characters. And we learn this not from the text, but from the illustrations.

- What, then, does Tove Jansson want to tell us by creating such a hybridised world?

- Tove Jansson wants to show us that we are different and that we don't have to fit into traditional schemes, typologies, systems and so on. And that this is okay. For some people, the overriding value will be freedom, for others the letter of the law, and for still others family. Hemulen, Snufkin, Filifjonkan and Toft, despite representing values that are not quite 'compatible', can reconstruct the absent Moomins family together in the final, highly symbolic volume Moominvalley in November. Of course, such a message is quite unrealistic and wishful thinking, but this is exactly the kind of world we want to read about and we have the right to do so. We are different, diverse and sometimes 'hybrid', so let's accept that and not change the world to suit our vision. Maybe then it will be a better place, like the Valley of the Mummies.